Good papers for Black Forest Cuckoo Clock?

Nepfreak · Post by **Nepfreak** » March 6th, 2009, 11:58 pm

I've folded two clocks now -- one in 12 x 120 in copy paper and one in tissue foil. The copy paper was too springy and did not hold together without duct tape (criminal!) and the sheet I used for tissue foil was too small (11.6x116 cm), with the resulting clock being too flimsy for my liking anyway. In both papers the locks didn't stick well enough to work, and nevermind locking the roof! So, I'm hoping that the third time will be lucky and my bird will look like a bird and not a rabid slug and that the deer head won't look like a horned jackal.
So, what paper do you guys think will make a good, stable clock without the use of duct tape and also one that will hold thickness well enough to, for instance, get those nice 3d ears on the deer and the horn collapses and the open beak on the bird?
I've heard some mixed responses about Kraft paper. One place I read that it's one of "the best origami papers anywhere" and another I read it's "too flimsy and not suitable for complex models." I imagine it depends on the brand and the thickness. If I were to try the clock from kraft paper, what would be the appropriate thickness? Are there any good online retailers of this paper?
Lang, the designer, uses "elefantenhaut" or elephant hide paper. Is this literally "elephant hide" or is that just a name to sell the paper? Is it essentially the same thing as the wyndstone "marble" paper that Lang also commonly uses? I'd be more than willing to go into wet folding if that's what it takes for a nice clock, but i've really only wet-folded two things before (insects in insects and their kin -- not really the best subjects.))
Another option to play with would be to "foil" another paper by sandwiching in a piece of aluminum foil. What papers are good for this?
One more thing. If this is possible, I'd like to have the paper colored on one side or a different color on each side so as to better bring out the clock hands.
Thanks a lot!
Ben

Sunburst · Post by **Sunburst** » March 7th, 2009, 12:32 am

I folded this clock twice, one with kraft paper and the other with aluminum foil, so I think I can help answer some of your questions regarding those type of papers.

Kraft paper is a good choice of paper for this model. You can get pretty much any dimensions you want and the paper itself is pretty resistant (as long as you don't fold too much over the same creases) and retains creases pretty well. One of the only downsides to it is that, kinda like kami paper, it «flattens out» as time passes. The paper I used was monocoloured, but I believe I read somewhere that kraft paper can come in two colors.

The aluminum foil I used was glued between two tissue papers. It's another good choice for the clock, but it depends on the folder mostly. The paper is resistant and holds creases too well (which can be as advantageous as disadvantageous, I guess). One downside to this paper is that you have to make it yourself, but you can at least choose any two colors you want for the model.

Hope I helped a bit.

Zoraz · Post by **Zoraz** » March 7th, 2009, 1:20 am

Another thing. As Origami_8 told me recently, Kraft paper can be bought at Nicholas Terry's shop, http://www.origami-shop.com

floopate · Post by **floopate** » March 7th, 2009, 6:44 am

i tried folding the black forest cuckoo clock too... i used something called 'maj-jong'paper. similar to kraft paper in western countries i think. i used a foil paper sandwich type thing. it got kinda thick at the end but it held the precreases pretty well.

i love your description of the rabid slug and jackal! hhahaha! i feel that tats kinda what happened to me too! i had to really wrestle with the two to get even something that doesnt look like it was dipped in a vat of radioactive waste. hehehe!

my clock is in my multiply. i think the address i in my signature

Good luck folding! tell me what paper you tried and if it works. cheers!

Post by **origami_8** » March 7th, 2009, 12:07 pm

Elefant Hide, Elephantenhaut, Wyndstone marble are all names for the same brand of paper distributed by Zanders. It is available in different strengths, but I've never seen it any thinner than 60gsm. It is a very strong paper that needs to be wetfolded and is the same colour on both sides. I can't imagine how Robert Lang managed to fold his clock with this stuff but I guess he precreased it with his Laser.
I've done the clock three times now and the locking mechanism is crap on all three of them. The first one I did was with a thicker kind of Kraft paper, the second one from foilpaper and the third one from double tissue MC paper. The double MC paper allowed for shaping the details very well, but I think when folding it again I would use foilpaper (the one Nicolas Terry sells in rolls).
Here are some pictures:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/origami_8/ ... 560959662/
http://www.origamiaustria.at/articles_c ... php?lang=2

ismetdai · Post by **ismetdai** » March 7th, 2009, 4:02 pm

i folded it with kraft paper,i didn't have trouble while folding but i used some glue when finished.12x120 cm is too small.it should be 20x200 at least.

Nepfreak · Post by **Nepfreak** » March 7th, 2009, 4:12 pm

I'm thinking of trying thin, foiled kraft paper. I've seen some finished models of pretty significant complexity (american lobster) on this forum from this paper and I really like the look of it -- holds form, and sturdy.. My only concern would be finding a big enough workspace -- I definitely want the paper to be at least 8 feet long given the thickness of the paper -- and the sheer toxicity of the spray adhesive. The stuff I use is this gold leaf brand that, going by the warnings on the back, is a brain tumor in a bottle. The warnings scare me so much that I find myself holding my breath whenever I spray the stuff and sticking my head out a window for fresh air! Any brands of spray adhesive out there that won't kill me?

Wait a minute, Lang precreases with a LASER? Or was that a joke?

ismetdai · Post by **ismetdai** » March 7th, 2009, 4:23 pm

i suffer from same thing.the windows are always open but the spray still kills me.i have headache and pain in my lungs.i need a mask or something to filter the air i don't know.

HankSimon · Post by **HankSimon** » March 7th, 2009, 9:02 pm

Lang is a real Laser Physicist...

- Hank Simon

Post by **origami_8** » March 7th, 2009, 10:31 pm

No, it was no joke, he really precreases with laser.

mrsriggins · Post by **mrsriggins** » March 9th, 2009, 7:45 pm

That's how he gets his models so pretty and precise

I always thought it was kind of cheating but *shrug* he's still one of my favorite folders.

origamiguy · Post by **origamiguy** » March 10th, 2009, 7:12 pm

The cuckoo clock predates his usage of any laser for origami. He did not precrease or score the paper on his cuckoo clocks with a laser.

He has only recently, in the past few years been experimenting with the laser, and recently got his own in his workshop. He has been using the laser to score the paper for his recent geometric and bowl/urn type models. You will notice that for these recent models, many involve curves, and precise geometric patterns.

Also, the paper would be too long to go into the laser device for precreasing the paper for the cuckoo clock.

Brian

Post by **origami_8** » March 10th, 2009, 8:19 pm

You could precrease the paper for a cuckoo clock with a CraftRobo

origamiguy · Post by **origamiguy** » March 10th, 2009, 9:10 pm

The craft robo and craft robo pro may be able to do this. The specifications on max cutting dimensions are as follows:

Craft ROBO - Maximum cutting range 200mm X 1meter

Craft ROBO Pro - Maximum cutting range 375mm X 50meters

I would not want to try it without having the dimension available with the Pro model.

Brian

bethnor · Post by **bethnor** » March 12th, 2009, 7:11 pm

ismetdai wrote:i suffer from same thing.the windows are always open but the spray still kills me.i have headache and pain in my lungs.i need a mask or something to filter the air i don't know.

!!!!

Please stop making tissue foil under whatever conditions you are doing if you are having these kinds of symptoms! It's not worth it! Buy foil rolls from Nicolas Terry! Crikey!

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Good papers for Black Forest Cuckoo Clock?

Good papers for Black Forest Cuckoo Clock?

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